Difference between revisions of "User:Hordes/Melee Comparison"
Jump to navigation
Jump to search
| Line 19: | Line 19: | ||
Notable mechanics: | Notable mechanics: | ||
* '''Cut damage has a chance to "cleave"'''. When a Cut damage hits an enemy, there is a chance to "''cleave''" an enemy. This increases total damage by 140%, then spreads it throughout body parts. This makes Cut damage less likely to destroy body parts, but causes more [[pain]]. [[Pain shock]] is, by far, the most common way to disable an enemy in combat). The chance of a cleave attack is undocumented. | * '''Cut damage has a chance to "cleave"'''. When a Cut damage hits an enemy, there is a chance to "''cleave''" an enemy. This increases total damage by 140%, then spreads it throughout body parts. This makes Cut damage less likely to destroy body parts, but causes more [[pain]]. [[Pain shock]] is, by far, the most common way to disable an enemy in combat). The chance of a cleave attack is undocumented. | ||
| + | |||
| + | :From EMPERICAL TESTING, 60% - 70% of cut attacks are cleave attacks. | ||
* '''Cut damage is more likely to destroy small / weakened body parts'''. When a body part would be reduced to 0 HP, there is a mechanic in place to prevent its destruction. An attack must do overkill damage in order to actually destroy it. A Cut attack needs to do <code>(Current HP) * 0.0 to 0.1</code> extra damage, while both Stab and Blunt need to do <code>(Current HP) * 0.4 to 1.0</code> extra damage. Due to the cleaving described above, Cut is still less likely to destroy larger body parts. | * '''Cut damage is more likely to destroy small / weakened body parts'''. When a body part would be reduced to 0 HP, there is a mechanic in place to prevent its destruction. An attack must do overkill damage in order to actually destroy it. A Cut attack needs to do <code>(Current HP) * 0.0 to 0.1</code> extra damage, while both Stab and Blunt need to do <code>(Current HP) * 0.4 to 1.0</code> extra damage. Due to the cleaving described above, Cut is still less likely to destroy larger body parts. | ||
| Line 70: | Line 72: | ||
==Comparisons== | ==Comparisons== | ||
| − | + | '''Assume no strong melee damage gene unless stated otherwise.''' This gene provides a massive change in comparisons | |
=== Normal to Excellent === | === Normal to Excellent === | ||
General rule: Longswords for unarmored targets and lightly armored targets ([[scyther]]s & [[lancer]]s). Spears are better against armored targets like [[centipede]]s, and not much worse otherwise. | General rule: Longswords for unarmored targets and lightly armored targets ([[scyther]]s & [[lancer]]s). Spears are better against armored targets like [[centipede]]s, and not much worse otherwise. | ||
* {{icon small|Longsword|24}} [[Longsword]]s do the most damage when armor isn't an issue. | * {{icon small|Longsword|24}} [[Longsword]]s do the most damage when armor isn't an issue. | ||
| − | * {{icon small|Spear|24}} [[Spear]]s are somewhat worse in DPS than longswords, | + | * {{icon small|Spear|24}} [[Spear]]s are somewhat worse in DPS than longswords. However, the high {{AP}} makes a difference. |
* {{icon small|Mace|24}} [[Mace]]s are outdamaged by spears until 68% armor (normal) or 78% armor (excellent). On a practical scale, most enemies do not carry enough armor to make maces worth it (in terms of damage). They are still the cheapest weapon of the 4. | * {{icon small|Mace|24}} [[Mace]]s are outdamaged by spears until 68% armor (normal) or 78% armor (excellent). On a practical scale, most enemies do not carry enough armor to make maces worth it (in terms of damage). They are still the cheapest weapon of the 4. | ||
| − | * {{icon small|Warhammer|24}} [[Warhammer]]s cannot one-shot body parts, so are completely irrelevant at these quality levels. Maces are | + | * {{icon small|Warhammer|24}} [[Warhammer]]s cannot one-shot body parts, so are completely irrelevant at these quality levels. Maces are 3x cheaper. |
=== Masterwork and Legendary === | === Masterwork and Legendary === | ||
| − | General rule: Longswords. | + | General rule: Longswords. |
| + | |||
| + | * {{icon small|Longsword|24}} [[Longsword]]s do the most damage when armor isn't an issue. With 61% {{AP}} at legendary, longswords can ignore a lot of armor. If you can only make 1 legendary weapon, make it a longsword. | ||
| + | * {{icon small|Spear|24}} [[Spear]]s do roughly the same damage as longswords against centipedes, even after AP. Enemies with more armor than that are rare. Against ''all'' humans, both longswords and warhammers can 2-shot even without hurting a vital organ. Due spear's poor damage spread, it must 3-shot to do the same. | ||
| + | * {{icon small|Mace|24}} [[Mace]]s are outclassed at this level. Against humans, warhammers have a better chance to 1-shot or 2-shot, which more than makes up for the slightly worse DPS. | ||
| + | * {{icon small|Warhammer|24}} [[Warhammer]]s still can't one-shot the ''big'' part, the torso. It can 1-shot from the head, but everything else can do that. It can 2-shot, but longswords can do that if at least 1 of 2 attacks cleave. | ||
| − | + | === Masterwork + Strong Melee Genes === | |
| − | + | General rule: Warhammers for humans and human-sized targets, longswords for large targets like centipedes. | |
| − | |||
| − | |||
Revision as of 00:02, 5 March 2023
Page designed to hash things out. Probably not a separate page, probably belongs in Weapon Guide?
Craftable
There are 4 "viable" melee weapons that you can craft in RimWorld. In order of highest raw DPS to lowest:
Longswords are the best (craftable) weapon against unarmored and lightly armored targets.
Spears are somewhat worse than longswords, but have a much higher AP.
Maces are special for being Blunt weapons. Most enemies have very little blunt armor, and Blunt damage has a few other special mechanics. The mace is also the cheapest of the 4 weapons.
Warhammers
are also Blunt weapons. The warhammer swings slower than the mace, but is stronger per-hit.
But ranking weapons isn't as simple as ranking DPS. There are many mechanics, even beyond armor and AP, that make determining the "best" weapon difficult.
Longsword
- Raw DPS: 10.71 (plasteel, normal)
- AP of "Best" attack: 37.4% (plasteel, normal)
- Damage types for "Best" attack: Stab (50%) or Cut (50%)
Notable mechanics:
- Cut damage has a chance to "cleave". When a Cut damage hits an enemy, there is a chance to "cleave" an enemy. This increases total damage by 140%, then spreads it throughout body parts. This makes Cut damage less likely to destroy body parts, but causes more pain. Pain shock is, by far, the most common way to disable an enemy in combat). The chance of a cleave attack is undocumented.
- From EMPERICAL TESTING, 60% - 70% of cut attacks are cleave attacks.
- Cut damage is more likely to destroy small / weakened body parts. When a body part would be reduced to 0 HP, there is a mechanic in place to prevent its destruction. An attack must do overkill damage in order to actually destroy it. A Cut attack needs to do
(Current HP) * 0.0 to 0.1extra damage, while both Stab and Blunt need to do(Current HP) * 0.4 to 1.0extra damage. Due to the cleaving described above, Cut is still less likely to destroy larger body parts.
- Sharp weapons cause bleeding. Both Stab and Cut damage will cause bleeding on hit. However, bleeding is unlikely to help the player; melee engagements are usually over long before combat penalties due to blood loss can kick in.
Spear
- Raw DPS: 10.55 (plasteel, normal) (98.5% of longsword)
- AP of "Best" attack: 55% (plasteel, normal)
- Damage types for "Best" attack: Stab (100%)
Notable mechanics:
- Stab damage is marginally better at attacking internal organs. Stab attacks are more likely to hit internal organs. And when a Stab attack targets an internal organ, its damage is not reduced, unlike Cut and Blunt damage. Note that attacking the internals isn't a common occurrence, spear or not.
- Stab damage is concentrated on 1 part. Stabs are more likely than Cuts to destroy large body parts, like the head, heart, and torso. Though, below Masterwork quality or so, this is unlikely to matter.
- Stab damage has the worst damage spread mechanics. If Stab damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed. If Blunt damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed and the arm is damaged too. If Cut damage would destroy finger, there is a chance for cleave to proc, spreading damage to multiple parts.
- Therefore, stab damage is more likely to "whiff", and damage can be wasted (especially at the highest of qualities).
- Sharp weapons cause bleeding. Stab damage causes bleeding on hit. However, bleeding is unlikely to help the player; melee engagements are usually over long before combat penalties due to blood loss can kick in.
Mace
Notable mechanics:
- Most enemies have little Blunt armor. For example, a flak vest has 100% Sharp armor and 40% Blunt armor. Almost all enemies in RimWorld follow this trend. A uranium mace is likely to have enough AP to completely ignore the Blunt armor of every enemy you see in the game.
- Blunt weapons can stun enemies, though the chance is small. If a blunt weapon hits the torso or a equivalent body part (a scyther's thorax, a centipede 1st body ring...), then the target has a chance to be stunned for a short time. This is completely independent from EMP and mechanoid adaptation. Stun chance depends on the target's health scale and the damage done. A normal uranium mace hitting a human would have a 2.7% chance to stun per hit to the torso.
- Blunt weapons have superior damage spread. If Stab damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed. If Blunt damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed and the arm is damaged too. Unlike Cut damage, Blunt is always concentrated on 1 body part first, making Blunt better at destroying body parts.
- Maces are the cheapest weapon of the four. Maces cost
50, half that of longswords and a third of warhammers. Maces are best used with uranium, which is a cheaper and less useful metal than plasteel. In addition, maces are the only one of the four to be unlocked with Smithing rather than Long Blades.
Warhammer
Notable mechanics:
- Most enemies have little Blunt armor. For example, a flak vest has 100% Sharp armor and 40% Blunt armor. Almost all enemies in RimWorld follow this trend. A uranium warhammer is likely to have enough AP to completely ignore the Blunt armor of every enemy you see in the game.
- Warhammers swing slowly, but deal more damage (than the mace). Well, it swings as slowly as the longsword or spear, for less damage than either sharp weapon. It swings slower and hits harder than a mace, however. This is relevant when considering the below point.
- Blunt weapons have superior damage spread. If Stab damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed. If Blunt damage destroys a finger, the finger is destroyed and the arm is damaged too. Unlike Cut damage, Blunt is always concentrated on 1 body part first, making Blunt better at destroying body parts.
- Blunt weapons can stun enemies, though the chance is small. If a blunt weapon hits the torso or a equivalent body part (a scyther's thorax, a centipede 1st body ring...), then the target has a chance to be stunned for a short time. This is completely independent from EMP and mechanoid adaptation. Stun chance depends on the target's health scale and the damage done.
Comparisons
Assume no strong melee damage gene unless stated otherwise. This gene provides a massive change in comparisons
Normal to Excellent
General rule: Longswords for unarmored targets and lightly armored targets (scythers & lancers). Spears are better against armored targets like centipedes, and not much worse otherwise.
- Longswords do the most damage when armor isn't an issue.
- Spears are somewhat worse in DPS than longswords. However, the high AP makes a difference.
- Maces are outdamaged by spears until 68% armor (normal) or 78% armor (excellent). On a practical scale, most enemies do not carry enough armor to make maces worth it (in terms of damage). They are still the cheapest weapon of the 4.
- Warhammers cannot one-shot body parts, so are completely irrelevant at these quality levels. Maces are 3x cheaper.
Masterwork and Legendary
General rule: Longswords.
- Longswords do the most damage when armor isn't an issue. With 61% AP at legendary, longswords can ignore a lot of armor. If you can only make 1 legendary weapon, make it a longsword.
- Spears do roughly the same damage as longswords against centipedes, even after AP. Enemies with more armor than that are rare. Against all humans, both longswords and warhammers can 2-shot even without hurting a vital organ. Due spear's poor damage spread, it must 3-shot to do the same.
- Maces are outclassed at this level. Against humans, warhammers have a better chance to 1-shot or 2-shot, which more than makes up for the slightly worse DPS.
- Warhammers still can't one-shot the big part, the torso. It can 1-shot from the head, but everything else can do that. It can 2-shot, but longswords can do that if at least 1 of 2 attacks cleave.
Masterwork + Strong Melee Genes
General rule: Warhammers for humans and human-sized targets, longswords for large targets like centipedes.